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Today on the BFP Roundtable James Corbett (corbettreport.com) talks to Sibel Edmonds (BoilingFrogsPost.com), Peter B. Collins (peterbcollins.com) and Wayne Madsen (waynemadsenreport.com) about the Hastert scandal and cover up, the history and context of this story, and the remarkable lack of public interest in the case.
SHOW NOTES:
The People’s Campaign: The Real Hastert Case- All in One Place
The REAL Hastert Scandal: Pedophilia, Drug Money and Blackmail
Senate Links to Pagegate Scandal (Madsen 2006 expose)
James,
Re: crickets on your Hastert material – I think a lot of that has to do with the fact that BFP broke the whole thing earlier and that many (most?) of your subscribers are cross-subscribers with there and have been commenting there.
I don’t think that’s the whole story, though – I think yours is the best label for the situation – “moral desensitization” – though Sibel’s “moral decay” isn’t too bad a fit either. You see that desensitization in two forms – in the majority that digs its heels in ever harder in its refusal to ever look at anything outside certain boundaries of discussion no matter how it’s flaunted before them, and in the “Irate Minority” where…. well, just to speak personally, once you’re pretty well convinced that, for instance, that not just 9/11, but just about every major “terror event” in North America and Europe for the last generation was more or less deliberately concocted as a means of state policy – that the political class is perfectly willing to murder not just “those guys,” but us as well, and psycho-traumatize the survivors as a deliberate piece of statecraft, where else is there left to go, in terms of moral shock and outrage?
Yes, our ‘leaders’ are psychopaths. Yes, they’re capable of, and pretty much do, every reprehensible thing you can think of on a regular basis. Should we in the Irate Minority be devoting more of our time and energy to publicizing every example of this (you *would* think that the whole “hey, our political class is a den of pedophiles” thing would be a particularly resonant one)?
Few seem to want to listen. The question of what drives interest for whom, and why, and how that can be, and is, manipulated, is one of the deepest riddles of the human condition. There’s so many different angles you can take with that – the enormously successful trick of psychology-as-propaganda that makes disagreement with herd consensus tantamount to social suicide; the seemingly permament state of mental and psychic adolescence that we increasingly find ourselves in; false dialectics each containing a portion of a bad/immoral choice; et cetera. Maybe the entrainment technology / EMF / fluoride ideas are more correct than we fully appreciate.
As a personal example, I would take my own mother, who has come a long way in her worldview in the last few years, but cannot and will not engage with this kind of thinking beyond a certain point. For her, it always comes back to something like – “WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU GOING TO DO ABOUT IT. I’ve spent so many years of my life unhappy and now *you* want *me* to ‘break my paradigm’ or whatever it is you call it so I can realize how much *worse* the world is than I ever realized and be even *more* unhappy?!” I struggle to find an adequate response to that.
I appreciate Sibel’s frustration with the apathy and moral decay or moral desensitization, the shocking non-response to these stories. Could it be that people are really just dopey and sick? trying to survive? Many diseases are soaring. Autism rates and asthma rates are soaring, according to geoengineeringwatch.com. Obesogens are in food chain http://nutritionfacts.org/video/obesity-causing-pollutants-in-food/
I think people try to live normal lives, being engaged and informed, civic minded, but get preoccupied (maybe not with the celebrity lives so much), but with staying well without health insurance, having less and less money. People may be hunkering down in their own circles of family and friends for security and to avoid the horrors that are very difficult for a childlike fun minded society to process . There are some urgent things getting thrown at people in this country.
I don’t know why the people re-elected Hastert, but these marketing of candidates are aggressive. like when Bernays gently coerced women to smoke.
Sure there is fear and apathy. We have an adversary that is a monster. Plus we are getting sick. Some of us have been used in target practice for weapons that leave no mark.
The best way I have found to process these horrors are through your programs and art. People need grounding to see truth and face the fact that they have been duped. Also, the bewildered herd, the great unwashed, whatever we call that group that we linger around and amongst–they need love and patience. What has happened to American society is part of the genius crime. We are trapped into paying for our own demise and are silenced like in the old Soviet Union.
maybe this is why we are so pathetic http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-10-21/endocrine-disrupting-chemicals-are-making-us-fat-and-giving-us-diabetes
Thanks for the excellent discussion.
I’m touched by Sibel’s question about the lack of public reaction. By degree, I think many, if not most, people interested in these questions will have experienced this lack of engagement from friends and family. It’s hard to pinpoint why: cognitive dissonance? controlled fields of interest through schooling & the media? general small-mindedness? is not shiny?
There is one element though that I find very interesting: hijacking. It seems very common for anything showing the truth of our world to get hijacked at some point in its revelation and then side-tracked.
An obvious example would be the Green Movement. As it came to light how badly large corporations are totally screwing the ecosystem from which we come and which supports us, it gets hijacked into a discussion about carbon, climate models and the causes of the global warming. We end up in an argument about data and predictions and completely forget the initial impressions which started the whole enquiry.
So, I think a large contributor to the question is that, even amongst those of us who show an interest, we are distracted and divided by an (intentional) hijacking of the real issue. This then leads to a meaningless squabble about the wrong questions which is a major turn-off to any bystanders who may have a passing interest.
Yes, there are many more factors, but I feel this is one I, and people engaged in these questions, can bear in mind. Remember the issue and don’t get sucked into the hijacked version.
When I started looking in depth at issues like this I got quite depressed and angry for a while.
It can be deeply unsettling to get a glimpse of the man behind the curtain, of the cracks in my engineered view of reality.
When I meet this reaction I try not to convince, argue or evangelise. Just throw some seeds.
Right Sherri, we have all been through this as well, but lance has the right idea IMHO: “just throw some seeds”. Anything else will just make enemies/discord and YOU will be alienated.
Certainly it is depressing to find that somebody who is intelligent, open-minded, etc. Actually is NOT.
My big huddle was 9/11. Logic and facts told me that was a false flag, but it is not a warm and fuzzy feeling to know that your own government is actually your enemy. I had done the research, but it still took me time to accept it.
Plant seeds like lance says and if you are really clever, you can plant the ones that makes them believe that THEY discovered the truth. You will be surprised by how fast they are willing to convince YOU!
Ha, HA!
I sincerely hope this topic continues to get a lot of focus from you James (and from Sibel, etc). This is absolutely fascinating and important topic.
For what it’s worth, I find it hard to bring up topics like this to friends. There’s never really a way to bring it up in “polite conversation”. Most people have busy lives (especially w/ the economy not doing great) and will probably look at you as a “wacko” if you try to bring up these types of topics. Even if they give you a few seconds and listen, they’ll probably assume it’s just a wild conspiracy theory that they don’t have time to bother with.
I always look for an opening when people complain about something (and try to relate it to a topic that I hope will lead to them opening their eyes). But mentioning this Hastert scandal (and pedos in government) is “too much too soon” for most people (even if you’re presenting solid evidence).
It would be interesting to hear people’s stories who have succesfully opened other people’s eyes. I’d like to throw out the idea that we shouldn’t discount trying to wake up people that we don’t know. For example, there are people on YouTube who make comments on videos that indicate that they’re at least interested in a certain topic. Maybe we can target those people w/ this type of info (rather than only toward people we know who might not be ready to hear this info). I do think that there’s such a thing as a “critical mass” of awake people that will allow real change to occur (and others who previously wouldn’t listen to start listening). We have to get to that point though.
SIDE TOPIC:
Can I make a request btw, that we have “Cliff Notes” on these episodes. Even though I watch these episodes sometimes I’m so blown away by what I’m hearing that I have trouble even comprehending it. Maybe it’s just that I might be blown away by one point and start thinking about it, causing me to miss the next point. I think it would be useful to make things absolutely as easy as possible for people to “digest”.
Thanks for the comment and the suggestion on the “Cliff Notes.” I think you’re right that there is so much information in an interview like this that it’s difficult to digest it all. To be honest, I had hoped that the comments section on the website would function as that type of “Cliff Notes” resource, where people would add links to flesh out different parts of the conversation or help others with their questions on various points. Unfortunately the comments rarely work that way.
An alternative would be for someone (or some group) to volunteer to transcribe any interviews they find particularly valuable. I’d be happy to post it, and the transcript can then be hyperlinked to help people learn about different parts of the conversation in more depth.
OK, Double, I have a story:
I was recently throw together with some guy from Venezuela by happenstance, this involved more talking than usual. (I would say “serendipitously”, but don’t want to sound like most commenters here! Ha, HA!)
I “threw out some seeds” testing his awareness level and I did mention Israel. He said THAT was the big puzzle to him: how such a small country could have so much influence over the WORLD!
He mentioned and sent me an email about this Michael Ruppert who was a whistle blower on the CIA drug running. The name did not ring a bell to me at all. That is because this story is 15-20 years old (I think).
His mother is a chemist for big pharma and he simply will not take ANY medications unless she approves, so he is aware of “oligarchy”.
I explained to him that there have been tons of whistle blowing in the past 15 years and directed him to this site, Ry, and WRH (Mike is good if you don’t understand ANYTHING, and is a good place to start. IMHO.
NOW, if he is anything like me, then he will experience a certain period of shock, shame being completely ignorant of the obvious, anger, deep sadness, etc., etcetera!
In this podcast, all 4 are overlooking 2 facts. They all have been aware so long that they forget THEIR OWN eureka moments. And two) People love to be shocked with scandal, bloody and guts, etc. But it MUST BE from the comfort of their own armchair or forget it. This is why Agatha Christie was so popular.
I agree with all of your points, especially the last one!
BTW, I often treat this highly disconcerting news as just a “Whodunnit”. It works for me and I thought that I would pass along my tip for coping. These 4 people do this full time and for years, they do not do much else, but we still love them. Consequently, they do go too fast for me as well. James Pilato was particularly guilty of that until I (and maybe others) called it to his attention and now he in the past few reports has slowed down, but still not enough. We need the “digestion time”. Brock West is that WORST but he has slowed down as well. Brock might mention a leader or city in Asia, and we have to have time to think where or who that is, or he actually should explain. They ALL can be esoteric, but after much complaining to James, he is the most mindful of it. (Thank you James)
TRUE, That!
I would not have made it this far without them either. Tread lightly Jude, “plant seeds” as lance (above) says. And if I can add, some grown adults still believe in Santa Claus and the Tooth Fairy, and these are the same ones that fancy themselves as “informed and open-minded”. So YOU must accept that as well. Good luck!
My ex-wife (with whom I split amicably) un-friended me after I brought up the inconsistencies of 9-11 on FB, with a final reply of “we were attacked by Arab terrorists – end of story”. And my current boss and his wife were involved in the truth movement from 2007-2009, but then I guess they chose to be re-inserted into the Matrix because it was just easier to believe the official lies than to maintain unpopular points of view. I had more respect for this man before I knew that.
However, with Hastert working out a plea deal with a judge with obvious conflicts of interest, I have no idea how to proceed. When the politicians are crooks and gangsters and pedophiles, and the courts cannot be trusted to prosecute these criminals, and people are still rotting in prison for smoking a little pot, I find myself disengaging from the entire game.
Frank Zappa referred to politics as “the entertainment arm of industry”. Most of the time I feel like if I’m not buying that entertainment, then I can put my various currencies to better use elsewhere.
As to your closing comment, I hope the system (which obviously DOESN’T work) implodes, and soon. When I see it teetering, I’ll be happy to give it a nudge.
Pretty interesting re: your boss and his wife; are they now believers of The Official Conspiracy? Why do they say they changed their minds?
I have a vision and in it someone has gotten hold of one of those ‘Party blackmail tapes’ and just like on V FOR VENDETTA and so many other science fiction shows, every tv and computer screen in the world shows it so at last the horrific truth is out for everyone to see.
It sounds like this was what was on the verge of happening in this instance with Hastert etc. and I could not be more heartsick that such a giant gnarly mess was so neatly shoved back in the bottle.
As to apathy, I have to say that some things are so horrific that they defy the imagination of the every day person. I remember 2 or 3 decades back reading an account of a child who had been abducted and kept for years because she was told if she left that 1. he (the monster) was a member of a large pedophile ring and that she would be found no matter where she went and 2. that he would hurt her mom.
At the time I remember thinking that only a child would believe such a threat. I was convinced that those who were so vile and despicable could never act in a cooperative and social manner.
It wasn’t until I began doing some really deep research that I came to see that in many regards the World runs on the blood and tears of children.
Some things are simply unbelievable at first.
Thanks to all of you who focus the hard light of day on this issue, one day maybe I will see my Vision …
I also think language plays such a huge part in this. Pedophile is in my opinion an Orwellian term. A Mother is one who Loves children. So we have to call them what they are, Predators.
I also want to point to a word that Sibel uses which I think is misused. She says the “fill in the blank” are ‘screwing’ children. I think a more appropriate word is that the “fill in the blank” are raping children.
Screwing to me is a hip term which implies consenting adults, but she is correct, the children are getting screwed.
@gary,
I enjoyed reading your comment, not only the content but the unconscious way you wrote it. That is all.
(albeit I hate 2 words: “veggies” and “congress critters” and don’t really know why) For me, I prefer, vegetables and the “whores in Washington”. The former has nothing to do with your “article”.)
More off-topic: Ryan Dawson was talking about 200+/- innocents being slaughtered in Palestine, which did not phase me too much. But he happen to mention in the same thread that once 2 tigers got loose and mulled 90 people to death, years ago. I am still puzzled as to why the tiger incident bothered me MUCH MORE than the more mindless massacre by humans.
Thanks.
Why are these people of power and influence more culpable? Are we still naively holding onto the cliche “lead by example”? I wonder.
At least “some-nigga-off-the-street” is seen as such.
True that. The beauty is that truth can not be unlearned.
After listening to Sibel wondering why the people on social media (as in FB for me) are not outraged about things such as this thing with Denny Hastert, I have to wonder who is she talking to? I am on FB daily and have a little over 1000 friends and can say without hesitation that ALL of us are outraged over things such as this! The majority of my FB friends are Libertarian/Anarchist. I would ask, what can we do?!! Still voting?..Nope. Yelling at our media? Done that already but don’t we know who ‘controls’ them? I know that some do not think to highly of FB but I can assure you those of us (and I would say thousands) are NOT apathetic…not by a long shot! We do a lot of complaining among ourselves, but we are VERY active about getting the news such as this out to those in ‘neocon conservative’ circles on FB! We may get ‘blocked’ in certain instances but the majority of us know how to get around those minor things. Just wanted to put a better perspective out there!
If memory serves me, wasn’t there a big scandal in Canadian politics in the 80’s about pages from the house of common’s. I will look this up
Couldn’t agree more with you at the end James.
Bread and circuses. Its as simple as that!
The MSM’s response:
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/why-dennis-hasterts-conviction-is-an-outrage-2015-10-29