Interview 1269 – Larken Rose Explains How To Talk To Statists

by | Apr 20, 2017 | Interviews | 22 comments

Ever wondered how to get your friends to understand that government is inherently immoral? That no group of people can grant any government rights that they don’t have themselves? That taxation is theft? Well, wonder no more! Larken Rose is touring a two-day workshop teaching voluntaryists how to most effectively convey the fundamentals of human freedom to their statist friends and neighbours. Today we talk to Larken about the seminar, what it teaches, and how people can attend.

Larken Rose website

Information on upcoming seminars

Candles in the Dark YouTube video


  1. Taxation and the White House Sean Spicer April 3, 2017
    Part of Trump’s paycheck was presented to the Park Service earlier in the Press Briefing.
    Sean was asked about the donation to a government entity. He responds that it can be difficult to donate money to the government, except for the IRS “And then, I don’t think you are giving”.

  2. Having knowledge other people reject on a knee jerk reaction doesn’t make you socially popular. Not caring about objectively completely unimportant stuff others get very invested in doesn’t help, either. Like the match from last night. Or a juicy reply one “representative” cast toward the other “representative” regarding horizontal orientation of said representative’s grandparents. Or what some tramp did, said, looked or acted like on the telly in one among a trillion of zero value TV shows.

    This being said, I really don’t see how can one opt to go back. I know cypher wanted to go back and I kind of understood he was so sickened by the truth and the reality, but he did insist on erasion of his memories, didn’t he?

    The moral qualm I have regarding turning others is: what gives me the right to burst their bubble? Nobody turned me, not directly, kind of grew into it and it took a while. I do understand the importance of making people see, but how many people can one be expected to turn? Two, maybe three? I can absolutely not see any way of doing more than 4 or 5. It’s silly to talk about it in these terms, but in the end, like every other conflict, this boils down to a numbers game. I don’t think we’ll be able to talk about being in the 3% for a while longer.

    Most people I care about are in their thirties, most are married, some are working on having kids, they are mostly part of the middle class (well, new middle is old lowish really) and they are living their happy albeit oblivious consumerist lives. Ish. I guess it’s incumbent on me to act on this, but I need them to show initiative, if not to make the first step at least to stumble in the right direction.

  3. I share the same concern that you do when it comes to mob rule. It seems inevitable that this would cripple a Voluntary society, or any society lacking general authority. This important issue with Voluntarism/Anarchism stops me from thinking that type of society could ever work when there will always be people trying to take advantage of others, violently or otherwise.

    Also, this symptom of human nature has existed since the beginning of time. Studying and reading a bit on anthropology I’ve learned that humans have historically formed into groups, beginning with bands, tribes, chiefdoms, and eventually becoming states. The bigger the group, the greater the consolidation of power becomes in the hands of few individuals, and then the corruption and abuse of that power always follows.

    How could a Voluntary society ever compete with society’s built on Statism, that controls military power. How could a peaceful society function given these circumstances?

    • How is this what we have now worse than mob rule? The last time I checked, mobs don’t commit genocide.

      Similar to claims that voluntarist society can’t work because of people sponging off the system. As if this current system isn’t choke full of sponges.

      • Genocide would still occur in a world where even large amounts of Voluntarist societies existed. Statist type societies will most likely always exist. Religion will also always cause fighting, violence, and divide enough people and societies for there ever to be true harmony.

        The bottom line is still that a Voluntarist society cannot survive against a Statist based society if the Statist’s decide they wanted to get rid of you. The military might of the Statist’s would presumably be greater and impossible to overcome.

        I really like the general idea of Voluntarism/Anarchism but I don’t think it can succeed on a large scale.

        • Pretty much every lifeform on this planet other than the bugs that live near Hydrothermal vents at the bottom of the ocean owe their existence to Stanislav Petrov.

          He saved us from statism once and gave us all a second chance. The scary thing is that he is unlikely the only one (just one we know about!)

          Statism is nothing but borrowed time, delayed extinction.

          • Mmmm, a timed extinction bomb.

      • I would say it’s worse than the mob rule. A lot lot worse.

        “… and they will summarily kick your behind’s squarely between your shoulder blades.”

        Thanks to the statists, yes. To that effect, statism isn’t the problem, the statist is.

        Anyway, looking at my failed state over here and the way it “handles” business I just have to wonder: what the hell is it good for?
        – the police ranks are full of semi literate idiots
        – the military (an obscene joke used for saberrattling on the behest of politicians) is pathetic yet expensive
        – roads are not built nor maintained
        – debt is ever growing (who knows what kinds of papers halfwit politicians sign every single day)
        – infrastructure is going to shit (what’s been maintained has been “monetized”)
        – the schooling system does not work
        – the health care system does not work
        – the welfare system does not work
        – people (those who WANT to work instead of grasping for the succulent state titty) are emigrating at an ALARMING rate

        There is NO MEDIUM TERM (forget about long term) strategy for getting out of this state, pardon the pun. Which makes sense, since politicians are a bunch of sellout halfwits of whom one can only get a rise during partisan maneuvers.

        Dragging into conversation failed states from across the globe in which a number of external interests converge will not bring this argument home. If various international players unloaded daily a few dozens of tonnes worth of weapons all across my country, I’m quite certain it would turn into the typical hellhole soon enough. External destabilization is a key which does not fit into this lock.

        Having grown up in a war torn country merely twenty years ago, I have to say the rule of the street wasn’t that bad. My neck of the woods didn’t see much anything of the war, not directly anyway. We hosted a bunch of refugees and there was the occasional mind washing propaganda centered air attack alert, but being a kid in such environment was for the most part OK. The rules of the street were known and elders were to be respected, unlike today. There was some crime going on, mostly unmolested by the police, pretty much like today. There were some dangerous individuals with war torn minds walking around, of course and people were quite decently armed, but there weren’t that many tragedies. During my growing up a lot more people died of leukemia than bullets.

  4. Psychopaths are a real problem. And they tend to infect others.

    Distance from their influence is one remedy.

    Decentralization can help one distance themselves from psychopathic influence.

  5. One of my biggest problems with anarchy is sheeple, the other is gangs – both are tribalist instincts that are inescapable.

    I’ve always been my own person free of the herd. But many like the herd. And gangs have a purpose, whether to build structures or cultures, catch serial killers, or thug mafia corruption, domination, exploitation, and violence.

    You will never be able to get people to quit the herd or gang mentality. Tribalism is part of who we are, for better or worse. Life is a balancing act. Mind/body, male/female, nature/nurture, chaos/order, and of course – self/community = tribalism wu-wei.

    That’s why I’m on the fence as a Anarcho-Marxist or Social-Agorist who believes in bottom-up authentic democracy (worker co-ops, etc), not the “Social-Democrat” or “Communist” top-down authoritarian illusion of democracy (voting, etc).

    I do agree that we need more anarcho-advocates to balance the mafia thug police state, deep state, war industry, etc. – even ideally to eliminate it, but like socialism (or a “free-market”), anarchy is an unattainable idealist fantasy/goal worthy of striving for.


    • = Corbett Report Torrents =

      If James Corbett approves, I’d be happy to (slowly) seed Corbett Report torrents of his archive, if he doesn’t want to do so himself.

      There are already several dozen Corbett Report torrents out there from someone but most are abandoned. (Those that finished are of the few things I keep seeding.)

      Many shows feature support information but adding a note with donation and support links would be good. Also translation or subtitle packs would be good.

      Re-encoding smaller high def videos in HEVC would be great (but very slow for me with my current gear). Also, I’d have to borrow the DVD TCR Archive from someone (as I have no money) if I were to do this.

      Torrents would be good for spreading the message, publicity, awareness, and maybe get by techno-censorship in various countries.

      Many torrent users may be Pirates and wouldn’t buy DVDs anyway, especially when the content is already free online. Then again, they may donate and support.

      Torrents have limitations like anything but it is a popular effective alternative to websites over the internet in an age of looming censorship. We need to support alternatives.

      Win win win!

    • = Somalia Oil ! =

      Over Christmas, my uncle, an aircraft engineer (mechanic) for the U.N. back for the holidays, was talking about the perpetual Obama US bombing in Mogadishu, the capital of Somalia, but it wasn’t covered by corporate media.

      Jimmy Dore explains that off the coast in the Indian Ocean is one of the largest oil deposits. Despite being one of the poorest countries, one province has deposits making it one of the 20 richest.

      The Jimmy Dore Show “US Now B-O-M-B-I-N-G Somalia, Guess Why?” (2017-04-18):

  6. I feel this runs into the same thing as the Koch Brothers, in which if we did, they will have all their money, land, and property, so I don’t see how this will play out or work.

  7. Seems to me true anarchism should be “anarchism of the heart”. Have a free mind and a free life. Work with others and share and make your life your own. Whether that builds into something more should be an organic process, I suppose. You will never erase the state; it has always existed in some form or other. But you can ignore and subvert it and probably live a nice life as many have throughout history.

  8. Psychopaths & Influence
    I think anyone can benefit by removing themselves from psychopathic influence. Of course, some psychopaths “get removed” either by a shot in the head or by being caged.
    Psychopathic behavior and influence tends to be contagious. Ethical behavior and influence can also be contagious.

    Sphere of Influence
    Each individual has a sphere of influence. The more distant from that sphere of influence, the more difficult it is to control. Example: An individual has extreme difficulty controlling National government, and in fact, even many politicians do.
    However, many things within close proximity of influence are more easily controlled by the individual. Example: A person can decide when to go to the bathroom, or Corbett can exert influence on a vast audience.

    By decentralizing, by removing influences outside the control perimeters of oneself, and focusing on those aspects which can be controlled by the individual, then we are on the road towards more freedom of control in our daily lives.
    In my opinion, anarchism and agorism and voluntaryism philosophy can help an individual to become more in control of his life and his surrounding environment.
    Control and influence of those things which are easily obtainable, which are within reach. Focus on what is efficacious. Fart off those things of which we can not control.
    My BB gun is no match for the military/police state/political/corporate/industrial complex. But it works for the squirrels in the back yard.
    More on PYSCHOPATHS…
    Corbett’s “kakistocracy”
    Corbett’s “psychopaths”
    Corbett’s “pedophile”

    • What do you have against squirrels?

      • Squirrels are actually in the rodent family. I call them tree rats. They get in my garden and will grab things like peaches just when they are ripe. They can tear up a garden. Squirrels multiply quickly and often are replaced by other squirrels. I used to “catch and release” to another area, but a new family of squirrels would move in. They made me appreciate the coyotes, bobcats, owls and hawks. ( I once had a pet red-tailed hawk.)

        • I didn’t know they can be such pests, I guess anything in large numbers/quantities isn’t good for your garden and/or health.

          I would get pissed off over having a freshly minted peach stolen lol

  9. “It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society. ” — J. Krishnamurti

  10. Please excuse my unsophistication in this matter, but how would it work with the roads, hospitals, and public transportation if we didn’t pay taxes?

    • I don’t know about your country, but in my failed state the state of infrastructure is in shambles. The roads are in terrible state, literally potholes on potholes.

      The healthcare system is in disarray, too. A lot of taxes is collected toward that goal (for instance, every month 15% is stolen from my paycheck for that goal) but the still the buildings are crumbling, the staff is underpayed and a lot of people from the medical profession are leaving the country for another EU state. All this results in the fact that, even after being robbed of those 15% I need to go to a privately held doctor’s office and pay for the treatment or procedure.

      Public transportation is partially private, partially state owned and as such in complete shambles. Fairs are not expensive at all, but there are severe safety and comfort concerns. Cabs are no alternative since they overcharge while stuff like uber is outlawed.

      Any of these could be handled by a private held entity a lot better. There are many local examples where people would pay a private contractor to pave their street after waiting for the state for 10 years to do it. You can petition all you want, but they still don’t care. It’s not that the “state” can’t do it, it just doesn’t want to. If taxes are collected for a specific goal, they should be spent on that specific goal, but instead taxes just amount to a highway robbery.

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